Brand Names
As a daily "home user" of Esperanto, I frequently bump into the problem of expressing something I've never discussed in Esperanto. This is especially true when proper brand names are used in conversation. Sometimes, I have to just express the word in English, which will by extension mean occasional word combinations from both languages, such as referring to the caretakers on a cruise ship as the "Fun Factory-istoj," or my last car as the "(Pontiac) Montana-aĉo"
Other times I have Rule 15-ed the product in question, and created words such as "Krispizo" (Rice Krispies), "Majtibajco" (Mighty Bites), "Triskvito" (Triscuit), "Valmarto" (Wal-Mart), "Spagetiozo" (Spaghetti-O's) and "Skajlajno" (Skyline Chili).
I prefer to butcherize these words if possible because then it is easier to put them in the accusative or to pluralize, and thereafter make more euphonious word combinations. I don't mind saying "Ni iras al Wal-Mart," but would tend to want to say "Ĉu vi ŝatas Valmarton?"
A very recent brand name I had to deal with was rendered in Esperanto more as a translation: "La Supermatĉo." I would be interested to hear how others deal with this issue... does it come up much?
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Comments
Superpelvo?
Tiu estis Elvis Presley, ĉu ne? ;-)
February 11, 2010 de hoss, 5 weeks 2 days ago
Rule 15?
Hi!
Having learned Esperanto about 7 years ago using the free postal course of ELNA, I hadn't found much use for it so far. Now, though, my wife is interested in learning it with me as a scholastic exercise and so that we can have a "secret code" (which hopefully won't remain secret for very long!).
I'm thrilled to find what seems to be a very active internet presence of esperantists doing something other than arguing about the grammar and lamenting lack of application--it seems as if something is really going on! It seems to me that Esperanto has been a HUGE missed opportunity for the world, and I never quite quit hoping that it will become truly universal.
Anyhoo, I noted above that you had "rule 15-ed" a brand name; can you tell me where this Rule 15 is found? If my wife and I are to get any use out of our studies, I suppose it would be just as well that we were up to date with modern conventions and usage.
Thanks!
February 9, 2010 de Eo-Usono, 5 weeks 4 days ago
huge missed opportunities
Yes, Esperanto is a huge missed opportunity for the world, but there is nothing unique about Esperanto in this respect. More than ninety nine percent of history is simply the chronology of the results of the world missing huge opportunities.
February 11, 2010 de Mike Jones, 5 weeks 2 days ago
Rule 15
15. The so-called FOREIGN WORDS, i.e. those taken by the majority of languages from one source, are used in Esperanto without change, taking on only the orthography of this language; but for different words from a single root it is better to use without change only the basic word, and form the rest from this latter according to the rules of Esperanto.
EXAMPLES
lakso = diarrhoea
konstipo = constipation <-- borrowed
mallakso = constipation <-- internally created
bona = good
mava = bad <-- borrowed
malbona = bad <-- internally created
komputi = to compute
komputero = computer <-- borrowed
komputilo = computer <-- internally created
arbo = tree
forsto = forest <-- borrowed
arbaro = forest <-- internally created
ami = to love
hati = to hate <-- borrowed
malami = to hate <-- internally created
dis = in various directions (prefix)
separi = to separate <-- borrowed
disigi = to separate <-- internally created
There has been much dialectic about this topic during the history
of Esperanto. For two good polemical accounts (from opposite
sides) see Claude Piron's La Bona Lingvo (The Good Language) and
Fernando de Diego's Pri Esperanta Tradukarto (On the Art of
Translation in Esperanto). What Zamenhof means by "the majority
of languages" is no longer as clear as it was a hundred years ago.
The 16 rules of Esperanto Grammar
La Dekses Reguloj de Esperanto-Gramatiko
http://donh.best.vwh.net/Esperanto/rules.html#importing
February 9, 2010 de formiko, 5 weeks 4 days ago
Rule 15.
Thanks! What a concise piece; I will add it to our instructional materials.
February 9, 2010 de Eo-Usono, 5 weeks 4 days ago
I do the same as you. I
I do the same as you. I "esperantize" the word, or I will translate the English words. We have a Superwarket here called Shoprite.
I say "Butikumĝusto" :)
Better would be "Ŝaprajto"
And you can always use the unofficial particle "na" for the accusative in a word that is hard to Esperantize.
February 8, 2010 de formiko, 5 weeks 5 days ago
Brand names
Like you, I tend to Esperanticize the name if possible. Usually, nobody understands right away, and they have to think about it for a bit before they figure it out. But that's part of the fun of speaking Esperanto.
Mi ja rigardis parton de la SuperBovlo. Gajnis la Sanktoj.
Scott Page
February 8, 2010 de swpage24, 5 weeks 5 days ago
Interese, mi neniam
Interese, mi neniam Esperantigas nomojn de la teamoj. Por Superpelvo-matĉo, Kupero diris "Indianapolis Colts havas bluajn ĉemizojn, New Orleans Saints havas blankajn ĉemizojn."
Alia afero, mi laciĝis diri "usona piedpilko," kaj en nia domo ni diras ĉefe "usonpilko," kiel nomon de la sporto kaj la pilko mem.
February 9, 2010 de KriZe, 5 weeks 4 days ago
I think we don't use brand
I think we don't use brand names as much in ordinary daily conversation as it sounds like you do. But sometimes. In such cases I think we usually treat them the same as non-Esperantized proper names of people. "Ĉu vi ŝatas Walmart?", same kiel mi eble dirus "Ĉu vi ŝatas Pierre?" kiam diskutante pri iu homo nomata Pierre.
Unless the name is very trivially/directly Esperantizable. Same as for people's names.
February 8, 2010 de russ, 5 weeks 5 days ago